Author Topic: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.  (Read 411842 times)

DOFFER

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #15 on: October 28, 2008, 07:15:03 PM »
thank you christopher for answering my question on bog babies  this was the first time i had heard the expression ,further how sad for all those parents to have to leave thier dear children without a proper burial ,i am not religious at all afraid ,but i respect those who do believe no matter what faith they choose ,and its events such as this one concerning the babies tthatmakes me wonder even more how any church or governing authority would legislate such an unkind law , are we not told babies come into the world innocent ,to those who had children buried in such a way i say if you yourself believe then your little ones are in the arms of the god you believe in ,may they rest in peace
Live your life in such a way that when your feet hit the floor in the morning Satan shudders and says 'Oh [censored] shes awake!!'

masser

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #16 on: October 28, 2008, 08:47:10 PM »

Masser,

I am sorry if you feel this topic brought up some sour feeling. However, I personally had never heard of the Bog Babies and found it interesting reading. I had heard of the mass children’s graves during the war; and even believe that I have twin aunt babies buried there, although I do not know for sure, as anyone who would possibly have that kind of information is dead. To-day I have learned another piece of Irish History and learning something new is not a bad thing.  I will reiterate what some one else has said on this topic all of these children are safe in the arms of Jesus.

I am positively sure that Christopher meant no ill feelings just a human curiosity.

Please don't take offense.

-Jen   :)
 


Jen hi
Thank you for your words of comfort. Yes it is hard to read such rubbish from some folk on here who have never set foot in the cemetery and know absolutely nothing about it.
The term 'bog babies' is very offensive to the babies and to the relatives.
The land was classed a 'poor ground' by the locals and buried there are souls whose families could not afford a proper grave.  This also includes the babies.
Because the land lies beside the bog meadows is more than likely leading to the wrong title being used.

Thank you for speaking up for Christopher.

I've noticed that he cannot reply for himself. I've spoken on a few subjects that he has written or should i say copied and pasted and he has yet to have the decency to reply to me.

Maybe he is above replying to me?

Now that should get a reaction. ...or not!

At one stage there were paths leading to graves along where the babies are lying. These paths have over grown with time.  Once the Church corrects the blunder made I wonder what other subject christopher will bring up about the Church.

Christopher don't throw stones into the wind mate, they have a habit of coming back and hitting you up the gob!How are things around Ballynahinch? 

charles w

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #17 on: October 28, 2008, 09:45:45 PM »
Recent posting by Masser.-

Masser[/b], I am still reading postings on this topic as I was the one who started it.

Christopher

Through out this forum you seem intent on starting topics about the Catholic Church a lot.

To save you a lot of bother asking questions here off members who obviously know as little as yourself, why don't you save a lot of time and effort and contact the authorities wthin the Catholic Church and put ALL your questions to them?

I think you like to muck rake things up Christopher expecially where the Catholic Church is concerned.


Why don't we hear for a change topics about other churches wrong doings or mis deeds...Starting with your own?

Please don't say the Catholic Church is the only church that makes mistakes.

And on another point...do you really expect the priest in charge of Miltown to be on site daily?

Regards
From a very fed up masser who is sick of your dirt digging...

And for your opinion I have a brother buried there...so your topic is not a nice one to bring up.

...

The term bog babies is the correct way to address these babies.  The fact is, they are buried in a bog.

As regards accusing Christoper of bring up topics on the Catholic Church, he was quite entitled to do so.

I have asked on numerous occasions over the years from the Catholic Church as to what was done with the money that they received for the sale of the land on which the bog babies are now interred.

At last the church has admitted that they did sell the land.   Who gave them the right to sell any land which belongs to the church?  After all, the people are the church - were the people consulted? Better still, were you consulted?

I would still like to know the answer.  Was the money put back to the upkeep of the cemetery?  If not, where did it go?

I am not sticking up for Christopher - I am sticking up for free speech and fairness.

The fact is that I left the Forum, as Christopher did not take a remove a topic off immediatly, as it was obvious the wording on the topic would cause an argument.  Instead, he got involved in the argument. 


Christopher

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #18 on: October 28, 2008, 10:10:18 PM »
Hi Charles W,

It's good to see you posting again.

Masser, I have a feeling that one of the subjects I raised about the Catholic Church involved concerned Christians running the 174 Trust and a Catholic school, in North Belfast, which was closed a few years ago. Baptists and Presbyterians helped with the opening of the Bunscoil and the Naiscoil in the North Belfast area.

Christopher

masser

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #19 on: October 28, 2008, 10:55:21 PM »
Charles W

Good you're posting again welcome back.

Bog Babies is Def WRONG!

But you use whatever term you want! Christopher brings uo topics about the Catholic church and knows sweet fanny adams about the Catholic Church.

He searches and copies and pastes what he finds.

But I believe my posts were directed at Christopher and not you.

As for you christopher welcome mate and thank you at last for replying I thought your arm was broken,

The topic I refer to was on suicides.


Mageeka

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #20 on: October 29, 2008, 01:18:38 AM »
 I am not wishing to confuse this thread by this question   However, can anyone tell me where is unconsecrated ground in milltown ?  I am speaking of around 1950
timeline
Thanks
 M

Chicago

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #21 on: October 29, 2008, 01:45:49 PM »
Quote
The land was classed a 'poor ground' by the locals and buried there are souls whose families could not afford a proper grave.  This also includes the babies.

Thank you Masser for the information. I have heard of poor graves. Probably have quite a lot of family buried in them myself.   ;)

I found this information on Time Magazine dated Monday July 05 1937, and thought it interesting enough to share.  O0

Quote
Unknown to most ocean travelers, every major liner carries a couple of coffins and its ship's doctor is a qualified embalmer. While ship captains by immemorial law of the sea have the right to order burial of bodies at sea, such is a non-sailor's horror of this type of burial that the bodies of persons dying aboard ship today are usually embalmed and turned over to authorities at the decedent's home port.

Two years ago, returning on the lie de-France, Miss Elizabeth Ann Ahearn, 68, a devout school principal of Danvers, Mass. who had been six times received by the Pope, died of a stroke while in her bathtub. She had been sleeping daily until noon because of poor health and her death was not discovered for some 14 hours. Ship's doctors found it inadvisable to embalm the body and the captain called upon Catholic priests aboard to officiate at a sea burial. Subsequently four cousins sued the Compagnie Generale Transatlantique (French Line) for $100,000 for their mental anguish resulting from Miss Ahearn's body not having been committed to hallowed ground in a Catholic cemetery. Last week a jury in a Federal court in Manhattan, to which the French Line had had the case transferred from a State court, refused any damages to the cousins after Catholic 'canonical experts testified that necessitous burial in unconsecrated ground is "not disgraceful." A letter from the officiating priest aboard the lie de France was introduced into evidence stating that though Miss Ahearn's body was in the sea, he knew her soul was with God.
   

- Jen   O0

We must all hang together, else we shall all hang separately....BENJAMIN FRANKELIN

jimbo

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #22 on: November 15, 2008, 06:56:38 PM »
Massa, (I couldn't find your mail anywhere, excuse my using this thread)

Are you referring to the kids pictures that I posted?
I was not aware that anyone had identified any of the kids.

Which picture was identified?
I have not been in contact with anyone.

If the pictures are no longer posted I will send them along.

Jimbo

[email protected]

Christopher

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #23 on: March 30, 2009, 12:17:26 AM »
Hi guys

Thanks to a poster on RootsChat I've discovered that the Ropery Lane Cemetery at Chester-le-Street, Co. Durham, has roughly 4,650 children in mass unmarked graves. There are probably many towns in Britain and Ireland which have similar numbers of children in mass unmarked graves.

The people of Chester-le-Street have a group called The Friends of Ropery Lane Cemetery which managed to raise £35,000 so that a granite statue, Stairway to Heaven featuring a little girl leading a younger boy by the hand as they climb stairs, could be built. Here's the link so that you can read the article. www.theadvertiserseries.co.uk/chesterlestreet/4241502.Cemetery_memorial_to_children_in_mass_graves

I'd like to know if Milltown Cemetery has a similar group. Doing something positive, as was done by the people in Co. Durham which has many families of Irish descent, is much better than standing at the Cemetery gates having a protest.   

Christopherf

irish dance

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #24 on: April 15, 2009, 11:26:10 AM »
Irish Independent last Saturday:--

The Catholic Church in the North yesterday apologised for leasing a plot of land that contained unmarked graves.
The grassy area on the fringes of Milltown Cemetery in west Belfast is believed to hold hundreds of unbaptised babies
some buried as recently as the 1980's and some adults.
It originally lay within the grounds of the cemetery, however, nine years ago the Church leased it on a long-term basis to the Ulster Wildlife Trust which owns the adjacent Bog Meadows parkland.
The Bishop of Down and Connor confirmed it did contain unmarked graves and apologised for the hurt and distress.  He stressed that the Church'soriginal decision to lease the land had been made in good faith and said all necessary steps are being taken to return the plot to the cemetery.
The Ulster Wildlife Trust said it would work to ensure the land was returned as quickly as possible.

The above is only a short synopsis of the article.

It was not until I read this report that I realised that I had a Baby Brother who would have been buried there  as he was full term but born dead back in 1951 - The sooner the land is returned and a memorial erected the better.

charles w

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #25 on: April 15, 2009, 11:21:08 PM »
The church has still not explained as to where the money received for the sale of the land went to.  I would like to know if it was spent on the cemetery or creamed off to somewhere else.   I hope that someone in the Andersonstwon News, or any other paper, reads this posting, investigates the above and prints the answer.  ::)

McNamee

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #26 on: April 15, 2009, 11:28:09 PM »
People buried since 2007 have a fee of £375 to pay for the upkeep of the cemetery.

I was in Chicago the other week and the folks we were staying with were telling us that a lot of valuable land in Chicago has to be sold to pay for the court cases of the priests that have abused the children.  The people are not happy that land they helped  pay for the Church to buy is being spent in this way.

charles w

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #27 on: April 15, 2009, 11:31:30 PM »
There is a monument in Milltown for the children.  It is on the edge of the paupers graves.  The coffins were piled 40 high.  Sadly, there is nothing in memory of the 80,000 paupers who are buried there.  This includes my great grandparents.

McNamee

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #28 on: April 15, 2009, 11:37:01 PM »
Charles

The Grave yard is looking well at the moment.  I was up on St Paddys day visiting and it look great.

It is very sad what the church did regarding the babies and also the paupers. 

How hard hearted.

Erincyprus

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Re: Milltown / Bog Meadows Babies.
« Reply #29 on: May 21, 2009, 04:07:54 AM »
Regarding The Meadows Babies as we prefer to call them.  After finding one Babies Grave, I have just in the last week found two more graves of my Families Babies buried in the Bog Meadows aged 18 months buried in 1941 and aged 2 years 10 months buried in 1914 so it goes a lot further back than has been reported .  In both these graves of which one holds 8 Babies/Toddlers and two Adults aged 52 and 75 Years and the other hold bodies of possibly 100 of various ages.

There are believed to be 80,000 buriels in the Poor Ground which is seperate from the Meadows Babies plots and includes some of my Family members that surcumbed to the Pandemic in 1918.  Some of these Souls were Highly Decorated Soldiers and Sailors that fought in both World Wars for us and they are all left without a Marker to show they even existed.

I believe there should be a Field of White Crosses covering this area to represent each and every Man, Woman and Child Buried there and where possible the Catholic Church should employ someone to go through their registers so each Cross has the Name and Date of Death of each and every Soul buried in Milltown Cemetery.  Volunteers are at the ready to undertake this task.

The information required to Find a Baby or a Family Member is Name and Date of Death.  Milltown Cemetery can then inform you of the Plot Number and at least you will know where you Family Member can be located even if it is in the Mass Graves of the Poor Ground. 
See New Thread on Forum..

Erin.
God made Whisky to stop the Irish ruling the World