Author Topic: St John Family  (Read 2137 times)

La Salle

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St John Family
« on: October 16, 2015, 08:16:36 PM »
I have been trying to trace my family without much success and hope someone out there might remember the St John Family who lived in La Salle Gardens, Falls Road.  My grandparents were John and Rosena and they had four daughters, Minnie, Alice (my mother) Ena and Pat.  My grandfather was born in Longford and had two brothers, James and Joseph.   I understand that my grandmother who was born in Co Down had no siblings.   

Fingers crossed some one out there might be able to help.

Love this site and it brings back many happy memories of holidays in Belfast (and Co Down) when we drove all the way up from Dublin! 

sam barry

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #1 on: October 16, 2015, 09:40:33 PM »
Is this them from the 1911 Census ?

Residents of a house 37.1 in May Street Little (Windsor Ward, Antrim)
Show all information
Surname   Forename   Age   Sex   Relation to head   Religion
St John   John D   34   Male   Head of Family   Roman Catholic
St John   Rosena Mary   26   Female   Wife   Roman Catholic
Graham   Mary Ann   41   Female   Mother   Roman Catholic
St John   Mary Ann   -   -   Daughter   Roman Catholic
St John   James   33   Male   Relative   Roman Catholic

U/1910/52/1007/97/404   Mary   St.John   21st December 1909   Female   Graham   Belfast
U/1912/61/1007/3/255   Alice   St John   15th January 1912   Female   Graham   Belfast

Surname   First Name           Year            Father's First Name      County   
GRAHAM   MARY ROSINA   1908         DUNCAN                      Antrim   

Surname   First Name   Year           Father's First Name   County   
ST JOHN   JOHN           1908    JOSEPH                   Antrim.

Record Type   Civil Marriage
Date of Marriage   25 Dec 1908
Groom Name   John ST JOHN
Bride Name   Mary Rosina  GRAHAM
Church   Belfast Roman Catholic Church
Parish   Belfast Urban 6
Civil District   Belfast
County   Antrim


CMcG

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #2 on: October 17, 2015, 07:06:38 AM »
Rosena and mother in 1901 living with a Rose Murphy at no. 24 Little May Street:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Windsor_Ward/Little_May_Street/976520/

The 1901 census gives their birthplace as Dunsford Co. Down.

La Salle

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #3 on: October 17, 2015, 07:10:23 AM »
Thank you for that prompt reply, Sam!  I have actually picked that information up as well as a little more detail, ie, my grandmother's father was a Duncan Graham, a seaman from Argyllshire which was news to me!  However, that name is so common it is proving just about impossible to trace him.  Nor can I trace any record of my grandfather's birth in Longford.   I have already tried the commercial sites and paid for my grandparents marriage certificate.  Hoping that maybe some of the St John cousins out there will see this!

Just had another reply while posting this.  What a great site!

Thanks again Sam.

CMcG

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #4 on: October 17, 2015, 09:24:06 AM »

Rosena and mother in 1901 living with a Rose Murphy at no. 24 Little May Street:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Windsor_Ward/Little_May_Street/976520/


BTW, should have explained, for folk reading your topic and wishing to help, the foundation for this.  When Mary Rosina Graham married John St John in 1908, her given address was 24 Lower May Street. Lower May Street was a.k.a. May Street Lower, May Street Little, or Little May Street. 

The 1907 and 1908 Belfast street directories, courtesy of the Lennon Wylie website, show that the occupier of 24 May Street Little was Mrs. Rose Murphy.  Rose was gone from that address in the 1910 street directory, in the 1901 street directory for that address she was shown as simply Mrs. Murphy.

Hence the basis for house 21 in Little May Street in the 1901 census (the 21st house enumerated, actual no. 24).


sam barry

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #5 on: October 17, 2015, 10:26:33 AM »
Bit of a long shot, but found this on www.familysearch.org. Just thought with the 2 christian names might be related ?

John Joseph Stjohn
Ireland Civil Registration Indexes
Name    John Joseph Stjohn
Event Type    Birth
Event Date    1872
Event Place    Longford, Ireland
Registration Quarter and Year    1872
Registration District    Longford
Volume Number    13
Page Number    250

La Salle

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #6 on: October 17, 2015, 12:33:44 PM »
Thanks for all this info.  The birth details look very promising as Great Granda's name was Joseph.   There is so little detail known by any of my generation and what IS known is a bit mixed up to say the least!   As a lot of you will appreciate, don't we all wish we had asked more questions while our parents and our aunts and uncles were still around?

Never heard of Dunsford although my father is from the Dundrum area of Co Down.  That also is a great new lead.

So grateful to everyone for all the help so far. 

JimG

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #7 on: October 17, 2015, 02:34:25 PM »
     from http://freepages.genealogy.rootsweb.ancestry.com/~rosdavies/PLACENAMES/DruDy.htmDunsford/Dunsfort/Dunsford           21: 56/41            a parish & a village ; 4km N of Ardglass;click here to see its location on a townland map;
 
same website
Miss    Jane    GRAHAM         .           Dunsford        daughter of Thomas Graham ; married James Napier 10 Feb 1851      CR
 

JimG

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #8 on: October 17, 2015, 05:06:53 PM »
have you seen all this
     
from http://www.failteromhat.com/post1845.php  griffiths valuation
St. John John Cloonahussy Templemichael Longford
St. John John Cartron Big Templemichael Longford
St. John Thomas Tennalick Taghshinny Longford
 
in 1901 census
St John John Cartron Big Corboy Longford 67 M Co Longford Farmer Curch of Ireland Read write English Head of Family Married
St John William Cartron Big Corboy Longford 22 M Co Longford Farmer Son Church of Ireland Read write English Son Not Married
St John Margaret Ballymacwilliam Corboy Longford 23 F Co Longford Domestic Servant Church of Ireland Read and write  Servant Not Married
St John Catherine Cartron Big Corboy Longford 64 F Co Longford  Church of Ireland Read write English Wife Married
St John Lily Harriet Edgeworthstown Edgeworthstown Longford 18 F Co Longford Nurse Church of Ireland Read and write  Servant Not Married
St John Martha Gragh Moydow Longford 49 F Co Sligo  Church of Ireland Read and write English Wife Married
St John William E Gragh Moydow Longford 8 M Co Longford Scholar Church of Ireland Read and write English Son Not Married
St John George Gragh Moydow Longford 54 M Co Longford Farmer Church of Ireland Read and write English Head of Family Married
St John Charlotte Gragh Moydow Longford 14 F Co Longford Scholar Church of Ireland Read and write English Daughter Not Married
St John Agness Ann Gragh Moydow Longford 10 F Co Longford Scholar Church of Ireland Read and write English Daughter Not Married
St John Anne Aghareagh Cloondara Longford 21 F Longford Servant Irich Church Read and write  Servant Not Married None
St John Gearge S Gragh Moydow Longford 12 M Co Longford Scholar Church of Ireland Read and write English Son Not Married
St John Phebe Gragh Moydow Longford 16 F Co Longford Scholar Church of Ireland Read and write English
 
 
in 1911 irish census St. John
2 in Cartron Big (Corboy, Longford)
St John Catherine 75 Female Head of Family Church of Ireland Co Longford Farmer Read only - Widow St John William 30 Male Son Church of Ireland Co Longford Farmers Son Read and write - Single Gill Mary Jane 47 Female Daughter Church of Ireland Co Longford Farmers Daughter Read and write - Widow
Gill Walter W 15 Male Grand Son Church of Ireland Co Longford Scholar Read and write - Single Gill Emily 11 Female Grand Daughter Church of Ireland Co Longford Scholar Read and write - Single Gill George 9 Male Grand Son Church of Ireland Co Longford Scholar Read and write - Single
 
9 in Newcastle (Forgney, Longford)
St John George Stuart 22 Male Head of Family Church of Ireland Co Longford Assistant Gardner Read and write - Single - - - -
Crawford John 21 Male Boarder Church of Ireland Co Kilkenny Agricultural Labourer Read and write - Single - - - -
 
 

sam barry

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #9 on: October 17, 2015, 06:35:16 PM »
If you go to the following site http://registers.nli.ie/  and search Templemichael Parish,Co.Longford scroll down to entry  no 711, there is a baptism for a Johannus Joseph St John, for 19th June 1872  with parents   ??? St John and Helena ??? the witnesses were  Peter ?? Malone and Maria Williams.   Its a very poor copy but it might give you some clues ?
The Microfilm number is 04233/02.

CMcG

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #10 on: October 18, 2015, 10:36:10 AM »

Rosena and mother in 1901 living with a Rose Murphy at no. 24 Little May Street:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Windsor_Ward/Little_May_Street/976520/

The 1901 census gives their birthplace as Dunsford Co. Down.


So the 1901 census suggests that Mary Ann Graham was born Murphy and a sibling of Matthew, I'm not gaining much traction on this  and it doesn't help that John St John's father Joseph (the tailor) was married to a Mary Murphy, I've seen the 1878 Co. Longford baptism for John's brother James and the 1882 Co. Antrim baptism for John's brother Joseph Patrick.

Looking at Rose's son Matthew Murphy in the 1901 census return for house 21 (no. 24) Little May Street, the closest I can see is one baptised in Kilbroney parish County Down with parents Matthew Murphy and Roseanne Caulfield, however in the same breath I can see a Bridget Murphy baptised in Kilbroney parish in 1877 to William Murphy and Rose Ann Caulfield, which makes me think something has got lost in translation, but no Mary Ann Murphy.

La Salle

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #11 on: October 21, 2015, 12:21:42 PM »
All this information has really got my interest and I intend to follow up everything you have found for me so far.

Some of it actually rings true as there was mention of a Murphy connection in the past.   Wish it was something more unusual!!

Many thanks again.  I am very grateful. :)
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Roy Joseph Maxwell

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #12 on: February 06, 2017, 01:12:08 PM »
Re: St John Family of Longford & Belfast. I am the Great Great Grand Son of the John St. John mentioned in the 1901 Census of Irelanday for Cartron Big, Corby,  parish of Temple Michael,  Longford .His wife Catherine Christie. Their daughter was Margaret St. John who married Robert Needham of Longford town, parish of Templemichael, ie my Great Grand Parents
Their daughter My Great Grand Mother was Emily Jane Needham of Knockanally, Kilcock, Co. Kildare  who married Christopher Grogan of Tirmoghan Common, Kilcock. Their only child & daughter ie my Mother was Elizabeth ( Lucy ) Grogan. if you search for mestage board postings by Roy Joseph Maxwell,  it have done several messages on St. John, Needham, Maxwell Families. Regards. Roy Joseph Maxwell

La Salle

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #13 on: February 14, 2017, 07:53:41 PM »
Thanks for that information.  I am still ploughing away but not getting very far.  Like many others, I  am sure, really wish I had asked more questions while my parents were still alive.
 

dsteven

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Re: St John Family
« Reply #14 on: January 24, 2019, 10:48:15 PM »
HI LaSalle
MY grandfather (James) from Little May Street, Belfast and your grandfather were brothers and had another brother Joseph all from Edgeworthtown, Granard.
I have been searching for years now and have other various pieces of information though still very shady.