Author Topic: brown family,east belfast  (Read 309 times)

moorsy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6054
brown family,east belfast
« on: April 14, 2019, 04:58:24 PM »
brown family info please.

this one goes back a bit,g.grandfather Robert married Sarah ( farley?) 9-10-1886 Albertbridge rd. congregational church

Lived at 66 foundry st. Might have been at Thistle st 1901 or Bryson st 1910.

Any further info would be great. thanks.
i,m out of my mind,but feel free to leave a message.

CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #1 on: April 14, 2019, 05:08:03 PM »

... Lived at 66 foundry st. ...


Hello, is this (below) the 1886 marriage? If so, it looks more like 56 Foundry St.

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1886/10840/5957587.pdf

 

CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #2 on: April 14, 2019, 05:26:22 PM »
There was a Robert Alexander Brown born to parents Robert James Brown and Sarah Fairley of 12 Ardinlaun Street in 1887:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1887/02563/1948057.pdf


CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #3 on: April 14, 2019, 05:32:59 PM »
And Frederick born 1888?

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1888/02498/1926715.pdf

Heading out now, fingers crossed you get some responses...


moorsy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6054
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #4 on: April 14, 2019, 07:14:13 PM »
Hello, is this (below) the 1886 marriage? If so, it looks more like 56 Foundry St.

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1886/10840/5957587.pdf

I think your close , I had the girl he married (sarah) living at 56 foundry st.
i,m out of my mind,but feel free to leave a message.

moorsy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6054
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #5 on: April 14, 2019, 07:33:17 PM »
There was a Robert Alexander Brown born to parents Robert James Brown and Sarah Fairley of 12 Ardinlaun Street in 1887:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1887/02563/1948057.pdf

CMcG  YOUR A CHAMP , heres what I have,I had his wife as Farley which as I see have been Fairley. SO thats right. The middle name of Alexander is traditionly the name given to the first born son in Scotland.  The second sons middle name of James could probably be after Roberts father who I think was called James, wife ELLEN ?  maybe. And I think they lived at 66 foundry st. in 1866 when Robert was born in 17 oct 1867. James wife might have lived at 59 cambrai at one time.
Where was Ardinlaun st located?
i,m out of my mind,but feel free to leave a message.

moorsy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6054
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #6 on: April 14, 2019, 07:57:29 PM »
Just seen that I made a mistake in that reply were I put a second son. Roberts middle name of James would be after his dad.
i,m out of my mind,but feel free to leave a message.

CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #7 on: April 15, 2019, 01:57:32 AM »

CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #8 on: April 15, 2019, 02:31:51 AM »

...  The second sons middle name of James could probably be after Roberts father who I think was called James, wife ELLEN ?  maybe. And I think they lived at 66 foundry st. in 1866 when Robert was born in 17 oct 1867. James wife might have lived at 59 cambrai at one time ...


The detail you mention above seems to correspond to the following birth of a Robert Brown at 59 Cambrai Street on 17 October 1867 to parents James Brown (a flax buyer) and Ellen Officer:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1867/03467/2273421.pdf

However, this isn't a good match with the father's details that Robert provided at the time of his marriage to Sarah Fairley in 1886, in the marriage registration (previously posted above), Robert's father was recorded as also being named Robert (dead) and his occupation was given as Mason.


moorsy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6054
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #9 on: April 15, 2019, 02:46:31 AM »
That "OFFICER " LINE AND Cambria st was one I tried,but like you said it does,nt seem to fit.

Heres what i,m thinking, Roberts father did live at 66 foundry, but died before the wedding,and Robert moved in to 56 foundry were Sarah lived,maybe because his mother had died earlier and he was on his own.  What do you think?

What a turn up seeing all those other siblings you found.
i,m out of my mind,but feel free to leave a message.

moorsy

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6054
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #10 on: April 15, 2019, 02:53:28 AM »
I notice Fred is missing from the house in the 1911 census. maybe he got married or something.
i,m out of my mind,but feel free to leave a message.

CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2019, 04:07:27 AM »

I notice Fred is missing from the house in the 1911 census. maybe he got married or something.


Fred Brown married Jane Meharg on Christmas Eve 1910:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1910/09997/5635726.pdf

The couple were living in Carleton Street in 1911:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Pottinger__part_of_/Carleton_Street/218938/


CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #12 on: April 15, 2019, 12:15:21 PM »
Where did you find the no. 66 Foundry Street reference?  In the 1886 marriage registration, I'm pretty sure that the address given for both parties is no. 56.

The closest online Belfast street directory I could find (to the 1886 marriage)  is 1887, given that the lead time for compiling and publishing such directories could be up to a year, I was hopeful that the listed resident of 56 Foundry Street might offer up a lead.  And it potentially does... on Sarah Fairley's origin, because the 1887 directory entry for Foundry Street shows the following:

56 Canning, Charles, labourer    

BTW, in what follows, the surname Fairley alternates with Farley, it's one and the same folk. Sarah Fairley's father in the 1886 marriage registration was given as Francis Fairley, a farmer. In the 1901 census, Sarah's birthplace was given as Co. Derry, in the 1911 census it was given as Belfast. Her stated age was consistent between the censuses, indicating a birth year c. 1868.   

To cut to the chase, a Francis Farley married an Elizabeth Canning in St. Anne's Church of Ireland Belfast on 26 February 1864.  Francis was recorded as a farmer, the son of William Farley (also a farmer), Elizabeth's father was stated as James Canning (also a farmer). After that marriage, the action promptly moved to Ballindrum just south of Moneymore in Co Derry, for Francis Farley and Elizabeth Canning had a number of children there from 1865 to 1873.  In the various birth registrations, the father Francis was described as either a farmer or a grocer/shopkeeper, but it's definitely the same man.  These births included the following 2 unnamed females in 1865 and 1869:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1865/03589/2323235.pdf

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1869/03413/2251932.pdf
 
I suspect that the Sarah Fairley who married Robert Brown in 1886 was one of these two births (more likely the earlier one, as the 1886 marriage registration said that she was of 'full' age - that would mean that her age in the 1901 and 1911 censuses, although consistent, were slightly understated).

I also noticed a Charles Canning who married Sarah Blair in 1872 and then married (as a widower) Nancy Lays in 1892, in both marriage registrations, his address was in Belfast and his father was cited as James Canning, a farmer, both the 1901 and 1911 censuses gave Charles' birthplace as Londonderry/Co Derry.  Given that James Canning was the stated father of the Elizabeth Canning in the 1864 record of marriage to Francis Farley, a hypothesis has to be that Charles and Elizabeth were siblings and that Robert Brown and Sarah Fairley, when they gave their address as 56 Foundry Street at the time of their marriage in 1886, were living with Sarah's maternal uncle Charles Canning.

So just to note the possibility that Sarah Fairley's parents were Francis Fairley and Elizabeth Canning, maybe something will emerge to confirm it (or rule it out) but for now it's the strongest option I can find.

Robert Brown's ancestry is proving even more intractable, the problem is that the surname and forename are just too plentiful to be able to tie anything down.  Although his age is consistent between the 1901 and 1911 censuses, folk back then didn't celebrate birthdays nor otherwise maintain an awareness of birth date and age the way that we do today, so if his age in those census returns was understated by even 4-5 years, then he slips back into that more difficult era pre civil registration of births.


CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484
Re: brown family,east belfast
« Reply #13 on: April 15, 2019, 01:10:08 PM »
The grave records for Robert and Sarah indicate that they later lived at 143 Madrid Street:
https://dof.belfastcity.gov.uk/burialsearch/BurialSearch.aspx?GraveSection=F3&GraveNumber=195&CemeteryName=Dundonald%20Cemetery

That address crops up in the following death notice:



Which reads across to the following 1903 marriage, in which the bride's father is described as Francis Fairleigh, grocer:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1903/10242/5727702.pdf

The family in 1911:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Court_Ward/Eglinton_Street/148386/

So clearly a sister to Sarah Fairley.

And possibly this as well?
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/St__George_s_Ward_Belfast/City_Street/954908/


CMcG

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 7484