Author Topic: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd  (Read 688 times)

Darren Taylor

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Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« on: May 05, 2019, 11:44:23 AM »
any information on my great grandparents  who married  at st Stephens church of Ireland 7th February 1896, who had 6 children Samuel Maggie Jane Albert Mary and Henry
My grandma Jane Simpson my granddad William rowan, who’s children where Roselea, lily, violet, ivy, daisy, Kathleen
Interested in finding out any information especially Jane boyds  and Samuel Simpson family 

CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2019, 04:54:04 PM »
I've a gut feeling that tracking back on the Simpsons and Boyds might prove difficult, Boyd in particular is a surname that is thick on the ground.  Anyway, just to kick off by validating / confirming who you are talking about, ie. the following couple who were living at 29 Cavour Street in 1901 and at 13 Morpeth Street in 1911:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Antrim/Court_Ward/Cavour_Street/934328/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Antrim/Wood_Vale_Ward/Morpeth_Street/164510/

These census returns provide indicative birth years of 1863-65 for Samuel Simpson (he might therefore be pre-civil registration for births) and 1873 for Jane Boyd (there should be a civil birth registration).

And presumably the following is the same couple buried in grave M2 347 of Belfast City Cemetery:
https://dof.belfastcity.gov.uk/burialsearch/BurialSearch.aspx?GraveSection=M2&GraveNumber=347&CemeteryName=City%20Cemetery

I'm initially guessing that the Margaret Simpson in the above grave (who died on  Boxing Day 1957) is the daughter of Samuel Simpson and Jane Boyd (ie. Maggie in the above census returns)? Don't know who the Anna Maria Simpson is who died in 1893, I shall look at it.   

So, the 1896 marriage registration shows the couple living at 61 Stanley Street, their birth years indicated as 1866 for Samuel Simpson and 1872 for Jane Boyd, the two fathers recorded as Samuel (Simpson and Boyd, both labourers):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1896/10476/5815329.pdf


Darren Taylor

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #2 on: May 05, 2019, 07:26:25 PM »
Many thanks for the information, yes indeed they did live at 13 Morpheth st.
I do know that my grandparents William Rowan and Jane Simpson married at St Marys Church of Ireland on the 23/5/1925.
I have been told that my granddad William Rowans mother Margret Rowan fell pregnant whilst working as a servant and had a illegitimate son (william)
there is no fathers name on the certificate, she also had another son Edward and no fathers name on that one either. (Edward died in the merchant navy WW2) so its all a bit patchy as no father to trace.
Not sure How may brothers or sisters Jane had, I have been told my grandfather William was in the British Army and the Navy at some point.
Just trying to piece together my family history bit by bit any help from anyone will be greatly appreciated

CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #3 on: May 05, 2019, 11:25:44 PM »

... And presumably the following is the same couple buried in grave M2 347 of Belfast City Cemetery:https://dof.belfastcity.gov.uk/burialsearch/BurialSearch.aspx?GraveSection=M2&GraveNumber=347&CemeteryName=City%20CemeteryI'm initially guessing that the Margaret Simpson in the above grave (who died on  Boxing Day 1957) is the daughter of Samuel Simpson and Jane Boyd (ie. Maggie in the above census returns)? Don't know who the Anna Maria Simpson is who died in 1893, I shall look at it ...


According to the grave M2 347 burial record, the Anna Maria Simpson who died on 26 April 1893 was a 27 year old married woman (Mrs) and residing at 221 Grosvenor Street, that is consistent with the following death registration, which adds that she was the wife of a carpenter and that the informant was 'Sam Simpson Widower of deceased':
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1893/06004/4708770.pdf

That would seem to tie up with the following marriage in Agnes Street Presbyterian Church on 5 June 1886 of carpenter Samuel Simpson (father Samuel, a Pattern Maker) to Maria Kirk:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1886/10833/5951549.pdf

A few months later that year, the couple had a daughter Annie:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1886/02584/1955189.pdf

Young Annie was then baptised Anne Matilda Simpson on 13 January 1887 in St. Philip's Church of Ireland Belfast, the baptismal record confirms her parents as Samuel Simpson (a carpenter) and Anna Maria Kirk of 52 Gibson Street.

I recognise that the Samuel Simpson who married Jane Boyd in 1896 was recorded as a bachelor in that marriage registration, but I wonder if that was indeed the case, or was the marriage to Jane Boyd a second marriage for him?


CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #4 on: May 06, 2019, 01:10:23 AM »
Belfast Telegraph, 13 August 1929:
SIMPSON - August 12, 1929, at the Hospital, Lisburn Road, Samuel, dearly-beloved husband of Margaret Simpson.  Funeral from his late residence, 13 Morpeth Street, on to-morrow (Wednesday), 14th inst., at 2-30, for interment in City Cemetery.  Deeply regretted by his sorrowing Wife, Sons, and Daughters.

The above-mentioned Margaret being Margaret Campbell (a widow nee Harper), whom Samuel married on 10 October 1925.


CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #5 on: May 06, 2019, 03:18:00 AM »
After you click on the link below, scroll down until you see the words Preview an image of this record, when you click on these words, a window will open containing a watermarked image, if you then click once on 'page right' within that window and twice on '+' in order to increase the size of the image, you will find that when you pan around, you can read William Rowan's record reasonably well, despite the watermarks: 
https://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D8579041

Like William's 1925 marriage record, William's father is stated as William, but as you say, the 1895 birth record (below) doesn't state a father's name, so I imagine he made out that his father was also called William as a convenient proxy:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1895/02208/1834021.pdf

Given that Edward was born over 20 years later, odds are that he was a half brother to William.


CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #6 on: May 06, 2019, 04:00:38 AM »
Just to note that there is a family tree for all of these folk on the 'ancestry.com' website by someone with the surname Bishop who from what I can see is related though a marriage for Roselea Rowan, there is quite a bit of information there and a few photos as well.


Darren Taylor

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #7 on: May 06, 2019, 10:25:31 AM »
Amazing information on there, new information so i have added it to my tree, I joined the Heritage site and sent the DNA kit off to Texas. I only intended to have a DNA test, but obviously this finding out about family grabs you and does not put you down  ::) .
With regards to Rosealea (I messaged Rowan 1952 on this site its up to him if he replys or not).  she was my mothers sister, my mother being Daisy Rowan,( now Taylor) Rosealea moved to England then to Australia and made a live out there, I met her once when she came to visit. William and Jane had Rosealea, Kathleen,Ivy, Daisy, Violet, Lily.
And the tree continues as I have 3 sisters, and i also have five children, Molly,Ryan,Lucy,Lily,Daisy !
William lived at Ewarts Row, Antrim and was in the Royal Navy termination of service 27/2/1919 i am not sure though as there are quite a few stamps on the navy papers, but it does say mother Margret Rowan, 49 Ewarts row, Trying to find out if he served in the British army as that was what i was told by my mother Any ideas ?
Can you tell me if paying the premium rates that these Heritage  sites keep prompting me to buy is worth it or not ? £154 extra.
many thanks for your invaluable help

CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2019, 12:30:38 PM »

... Trying to find out if he served in the British army as that was what i was told by my mother Any ideas ?
Can you tell me if paying the premium rates that these Heritage  sites keep prompting me to buy is worth it or not ? £154 extra ...


He did, he signed up at Belfast for the Royal Irish Rifles on 1 January 1915, his stated address was 63 Walton Street Belfast, his age 19 years and 5 months, his next of kin was given as his mother Margaret at the aforementioned address.  However, he was discharged 49 days later for reasons that aren't given. He may have signed up again thereafter, I couldn't find a record for same, but there again, so very many (over 50%) of the military records were destroyed in 1940 when a German bombing raid struck the War Office repository.

In relation to the Heritage website, I've never used it so can't comment, however I've never encountered any one website that is a silver bullet for everything, they all have their strong and weak areas in terms of what geographic coverage they have and what record coverage they have, but in general principle, my inclination is to shy away from 'premium' deals and packages for the same reason that I don't purchase gap insurance or additional underbody anti-rust treatment for a new car - invariably, such deals and packages turn out to be things that I don't need. 


Darren Taylor

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2019, 04:14:14 PM »
Brilliant short lived, but he was in the Army like my mother told me, he had a bit of a cross eye so maybe he could not shoot straight lol, i have just logged all this information, getting a little bit confused as they all called the same names Samuel and Jane, So glad i started this now as such a wealth of information about my family is here.
Does anyone know about Edward Rowan, Williams brother i know he died in the merchant navy apparently a German u boat torpedo .
Any records of his life and death naval records anything would be a massive help, all my mother has is one photo on her mantelpiece, he is in his uniform.
Yes i will avoid paying money to these sites as ive been taken for a ride on other sites as they just keep asking for money, money on each record found, I'm searching the archives for Edward but as of now i have not got a lead.


CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #10 on: May 07, 2019, 08:32:25 AM »

... all my mother has is one photo on her mantelpiece, he is in his uniform ...


Is it the same one as this?
https://www.wrecksite.eu/wreck.aspx?12994

The photo in the above link was posted by a David Bishop (same name as the person who I mentioned with the family tree and photos on the 'ancestry.com' website), he describes Edward as his Great Uncle.

Edward Rowan is memorialised on Panel 83 of the Tower Hill Memorial in London:
https://www.cwgc.org/find/find-cemeteries-and-memorials/90002/tower-hill-memorial





What happened to the M.V. Port Gisborne is summarised here:
https://uboat.net/allies/merchants/ship/585.html


CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #11 on: May 07, 2019, 08:57:15 AM »
A short while earlier (August 1940), his name and his mother's name appeared in the Belfast Telegraph as contributors to the Spitfire Fund, as you can see, he had to get a word in for the Navy:



The PRONI Will Calendars Index show the following entry for him ('Administration' = no will):

Rowan Edward of 49 Ewarts Row Belfast engineer died 11 October 1940 at sea as result of enemy action Administration Belfast 22 January to Margaret Rowan widow. Effects £72 16s. 6d.


Darren Taylor

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #12 on: May 07, 2019, 09:15:59 PM »
Absolutely fantastic to see all this, I was told by my mother that William Rowan visited the  plaque memorial in London, that's the first time any of us have seen it, and the lifeboat overturning in galeforce winds was  think a drive down to London is in order. Genuinely cant thank you enough for all the effort you have put into uncovering all this information.
I am still looking into the history of the simpsons, boyds, rowans and hope to find out more.
thanks.

Darren Taylor

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #13 on: May 08, 2019, 06:32:56 AM »
Ps yes thats the exact photograph not sure if its a professional photo or taken in a house.

CMcG

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Re: Samuel Simpson and Jane boyd
« Reply #14 on: May 08, 2019, 07:09:04 AM »
If not professional, then it's mimicking one, with its painted / curtained background and the obligatory piece of furniture to pose with. However, a professional photographer would not cut the foot off... but there again, maybe the photo was cut down to size a bit.