Author Topic: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)  (Read 896 times)

PGTIP86

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Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« on: July 29, 2019, 12:38:50 AM »
Hi, anyone doing any research on Gourley from East Belfast?

JimG

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #1 on: July 29, 2019, 08:29:31 AM »

Welcome, start with the Gourley index of 9 pages relating to Gourley here use the search button top rhs icon marked google Custom search
http://www.belfastforum.co.uk/results.php?cx=partner-pub-2147458875638986%3A2837595630&cof=FORID%3A10&ie=UTF-8&q=gourley&sa=Search&siteurl=www.belfastforum.co.uk%2Findex.php%3Ftopic%3D77304.0&ref=www.belfastforum.co.uk%2Findex.php%3Fboard%3D20.0&ss=4784j4060672j7
As soon as possible add your say  grandparents names any address,if you know them and that should get you own lines established going backwards or if you know where a relative is buried that helps.
good luck and have fun

PGTIP86

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #2 on: July 30, 2019, 12:23:12 AM »
Thanks for this JimG. I'll check it out any rewrite my post.

mccrystr

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #3 on: July 31, 2019, 08:44:57 AM »
My Grandmother was a Gourley and her sister Jane ended up living with her. Jane had one son John.

JimG

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #4 on: August 01, 2019, 11:37:27 AM »

Hi ALL Goorley/Gourlay/Gourley/Gourly /Gurley/ Gurly / Mc Gourley etc interested people, the real starting point for family historians seeking Belfast connections is to find the last address or resting place of your oldest person in your family relatives with the purpose of connecting into some record eg 1911 census see http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/search/ then you have every chance of finding more generations in earlier records, but first you have to find the right spelling eg Gourly spelling is only at Ardenlee and Hillman st in 1911 Census . Once you are into the census religous denomination helps

Do any of the addresses below sound familiar to your line
a nearly complete list of householders exists in 1918,  here is Mary Lennons great effort
http://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/alphanames1918FG.htm

arranged Alphabetically by Street Name
Gourley    Hugh    bread server      Ardenlee   Avenue[LILYBANK]
Gourley    Robert    joiner   47   Belvoir   Street
Gourley    Miss Lizzie      28   Bendigo   Street
Gourley    David    hair dresser   12   Castlereagh   Street
Gourley    Mrs. Margt.   66   Castlereagh   Street
Gourley    John    iron turner   6   Chadolly   Street
Gourley    J.    cutter   3   College   Place North
Gourley    David    carpenter   156   Donegall   Road
Gourlay    Jas.    compositor   22   Dundela   Avenue
Gourley    Jas.    shipwright   2   Edgar   Street
Gourley    Andrew    carpenter   32   Glendower   Street
Gourley    John    carpenter   12   Glentoran   Street
Gourley    Robt.    traveller   66   Groomsport   Street
Gourley    John    boot maker   9   Hillview   Avenue
Gourley    Geo.    carrier   79   Hopeton   Street
Gourley    R. S.    agent   32   Linenhall   Street
Gourley    H.    book maker   3   Lisbon   Street
Gourley    George    clerk   7   Lothair   Avenue
Gourley    W. C.    jeweller   138   Oldpark   Avenue
Gourley    J.    smith   11   Solway   Street
Gourley    Thomas      18   Willowbank   Street
Gourley    Thos.    engine driver   191   Woodstock   Road
Gourley    R. S.    warehouseman   22   Woodvale   Avenue
Gourley    Jos.    grocer and egg merchant   240   York   Street
if no Street connections try searching on her website in the directories for  1924 - 1932 - 1943 - 1951 - 1960
take 1960, open it, type in Gourley 1960 and then work your way down each entry looking for the initial or first name of your relative who would be the head of house. then work backwards  try 1951 then 1943 etc etc
in the 1912 directory I found Gurley, J., machine master 20 Barbour Street Greencastle Belfast  20. Gurley, J., machine master

diverting further onto the name spelt Gurley/ Gurly in Griffiths Valuation 1847-1864
 they lived only inDublin[1], Galway[2], Kildare[1], Waterford[1], Wexford[2] . then try  the 1901 &1911 census. in 1911 there is a William living as a boarder in Larne.  In Belfast working in  as a laundress in 51 Lisburn Rd one of four such staff is an Elizabeth Gurley aged 42 born in England she is not listed as such in 1901 census England
end of part 1


JimG

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #5 on: August 01, 2019, 11:38:16 AM »

continued
A quick source for mainly protestant Gourley burials with last known https://dof.belfastcity.gov.uk/burialsearch/address .  A much slower bmd excellent resource for church and civic records is https://www.irishgenealogy.ie/en/

The McGourley in Belfast recorded in Griffiths valuation about 1860 are
Surname   First Name   Townland   Parish   County
Mc Gourley   Mary   Smithfield Edenderry Norfolk Street   Shankill   Antrim
Mc Gourley   Denis   St. George's Ward Townparks Irwin Street   Shankill   Antrim
time running out
keep a record of where you found each relative and see how far you go
then perhaps we can help more
good luck


PGTIP86

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #6 on: August 01, 2019, 01:39:40 PM »
David Gourley 12 Castlereagh Street is my G-G Uncle. He was 1 of 4 children to James & Grace Gourley (nee McVeigh) Eldest child Samuel is my G-Granda who married Jane Marden and they had 5 children - James, Annie, Thomas, Grace & Samuel. Thomas is my Granda.
Samuel and David (2 brothers) married 2 sisters.
I have all information on my family from James right down to myself.
I looked into some of the other Gourleys from the census - Robert 47 Belvoir St & Thomas 191 Woodstock Rd and I think I have a connection but only 90% certain they are connections.

JimG

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #7 on: August 01, 2019, 05:50:30 PM »
hi I think I am only producing your own work
James and Grace Gourley your gt gt grandparents was he james gourley packer 7 Ballycastle st off oldpark road in 1899 street directory see https://streetdirectories.proni.gov.uk/media/vlCbImPjExjEl871KbFtvQ..a?ts=zltE-zg6fENenv8PAqoG2w..a

i combine the 1901 and 1911 census see National archives
residence 1901 census   8 in Rotterdam Street (Pottinger, Down) off bridgend . not there in 1901 st directory Real St N in 1910 was No 8 [in 1901 at no 12ived a  T Marsden  keep for later use]
residence 1911 census   12 in Castlereagh St Street (Pottinger, Down) ran  Albertbridge Road to Beersbridge Road street directory real no 12 in 1912 shows head of house David hairdresser so what has happened also 66. Gourley, Mrs. Margaret possible rel?

1. James Gourley  40 [49 1911]Male Head of Family Presbetrain County Down Labourer General 1901 Dock labourer 1911Read and write English Married
m ~1883 s1911c Grace Gourley nee McVeigh 45 [57 19i1Female Wife Presbetrain County Down House Keeper Read and write English Married -
children
1.1    Samuel Gourley 17 b~1884 Male Son Presbetrain Ballymacartt Engin(e) Cleaner Read and write English Not Married –did he m m 1907 Jane Marsden? ancestry Ireland if correct and your gt grandfather
1.1.1.   James Gourley
1.1.2.  Annie Gourley,
1.1.3.  Thomas Gourley b 1908 Co Down, ancestry Ireland if correct your grandad
1.1.4.  Grace Gourley
1.1.5.  Samuel Gourley
1.2. Isabella Gourley 16 b~1884 Female Daughter Presbetrain County Down Sti(t)cher in Wareroom Read and write English Not Married -
1.3. Agness Gourley 1901c age15 b~1884 [1911 26] Female Daughter Presbetrain County Down in a La(u)nderry 1901 [linen examiner] 1911 Read and write English Not Married -
1.4. David Gourley 14 b~1884 [1911 24] Male Son Presbetrain County Down Bottling in Spir(i)t and Store 1901, [Hairdresser 1911]Read and write English Not Married –your gt gt uncle?
 
a boarder in 1901
McCune John 19 Male Boarder Presbetrain County Down Engin(e) Cleaner Read and write English Not Married –
no boarders in1911

Gourleys in 1880 st directory lennonwtylie
Gourley, Edward, grocer, 11 Benwell Street
Gourley, George, carrier, 79 Hopeton Street
Gourley, Mrs., 335 Newtownards Road
Gourley, Thomas, book keeper, 25 Shannon Street
Gourley, Thomas, carpenter, 121 North Street
Gourley, Thomas, family grocer, 165 & 167 Old Lodge Road
Gourley, Thomas, family grocer, 1 & 2 Bridge End
Gourley & Co., provision merchants, 41 Mill Street
Gourlie, N. MacVicar, secretary Scottish Widows' Fund Life Assurance Society, 2 High Street, res., Kincraig, Antrim Road
if james was the son of a Thomas engine driver see the 1890 version of aboveit might explain why so many engine cleaners
 I’ll stop here if i find inspiration i will be back


CMcG

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #8 on: August 01, 2019, 11:25:06 PM »

... I have all information on my family from James right down to myself.


Trying to push further back (ie. before James), I wondered about the following possibility...

I noticed that in the 1882 civil registration record of marriage, James Gourley's address was given as 23 Wolff Street and his father as Thomas Gourley, a farmer.  The 1884 Belfast street directory listed the following entry for 23 Wolff Street:
Gourley, T., enginedriver 

That reads across to the following birth at that same address in 1884, it's for a daughter Grace McVeigh Gourley to parents Thomas Gourley (engine driver) and Elizabeth Bennett:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1884/02705/1996176.pdf

I wonder was Thomas a brother to James? Thomas Gourley married Elizabeth Bennett (married name Hughes) in 1873, however, while the groom's father was listed as Thomas Gourley (like James' father), the father's occupation was given as station master (unlike James' father, who was cited as farmer):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1873/11269/8132800.pdf
 
This looks like Thomas Gourley and Elizabeth Bennett in 1901 and 1911:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Pottinger/Mountpottinger_Road/1215319/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Ormeau/Carrington_Street/210859/

While the above census returns (and those for James Gourley) indicate that Thomas and James were born pre civil registration of births, I did notice the following run of births post civil registration for a Thomas Gourley and Agnes Carse in Ballygowan right up to 1872, the point of interest being that Thomas was described in the births both as a farmer and a station master, eg.:

Henry #1 b. 1865 (father Thomas a farmer):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1865/03577/2318623.pdf

Mary b. 1866 (father Thomas a farmer):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1866/03534/2300803.pdf

Robert b. 1868 (father Thomas a farmer):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1868/03458/2269942.pdf

Henry #2 b. 1869 (father Thomas a station master):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1869/03377/2238211.pdf

Agnes b. 1870 (father Thomas a station master):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1870/03327/2219811.pdf

Martha b. 1872 (father Thomas a station master):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1872/03227/2183183.pdf

Thomas Gourley of Magherascouse married Nancy Carse of the same place on 7 October 1848 in Ballygowan Presbyterian Church.  Bachelor Thomas was described in the church marriage record as a 24 year old farmer, the son of John Gourley, also a farmer.  Spinster Nancy was the 19 year old daughter of Henry Carse, a farmer. The witnesses were William Morrow and James Carse.
   
Agnes Gourley in 1901/1911?
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Down/Ballygowan/Ballygowan/1257478/
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Down/Ballygowan/Magherascouse/266525/

Death of a Nancy Gourley in 1916 (informant Susanna Gibson, daughter):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1916/05239/4451669.pdf

The marriage of Susanna Gourley to Hugh Gibson in Ballygowan Presbyterian Church in 1895, the bride's father given as Thomas Gourley, a farmer (note also a Carse witness):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1895/10525/5833649.pdf

The death of a station master called Thomas Gourley at Ballygowan in 1879, the informant was a James Gourley:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/deaths_returns/deaths_1879/06520/4878586.pdf

The PRONI website has a will for this man which can be read online:
The Will of Thomas Gourley late of Ballygowan County Down Stationmaster deceased who died 28 April 1879 at same place was proved at Belfast by the oaths of Robert Gourley and Henry Boyce both of Magherascouse (Ballygown) same County Farmers two of the Executors.


PGTIP86

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #9 on: August 02, 2019, 12:07:41 AM »
Impressive work in such a short space of time guys!
CMcG - Both the Thomas you found i have looked at and studied in fine detail to see if i can find something that jumps out as a direct connection but only came up with stuff that could make it a possible connection. For every detail that i find a connection i then find 2 things that make it not a connection so i am hitting my head off brick wall.
However there has to definitely be a connection between James and Thomas who both lived at sames address only 2 years apart, seems too much of a coincidence for them having same name and not related. The amount of theories you can come up with when reading between the lines is unreal.

CMcG

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #10 on: August 02, 2019, 12:33:00 AM »

CMcG - Both the Thomas you found i have looked at and studied in fine detail to see if i can find something that jumps out as a direct connection but only came up with stuff that could make it a possible connection. For every detail that i find a connection i then find 2 things that make it not a connection so i am hitting my head off brick wall.
 

Can you provide details of the things that rule this out?

The reason I ask is that the contemporary match in address (BTW, the 1884 street directory would have reflected residence up to 12 months before, due to the compilation lead time) is only part of the equation, the other part is the fact that Thomas Gourley and Elizabeth Bennett chose to name their daughter Grace McVeigh Gourley, a year and a few months after James Gourley married Grace McVeigh, the odds of that being an unrelated coincidence are low.


PGTIP86

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #11 on: August 02, 2019, 12:41:54 AM »
Ill get back to you on this one and ill go through everything i have about them all. Ive looked at it so much everything i have in my head is all over the place. Grace McVeigh must have been some woman because Grace & McVeigh has been used several times within my family. Unfortunately i have very little people within my family who i ca ask questions to. Ive taught my family more about the Gourleys than they actually realised.

JimG

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #12 on: August 02, 2019, 10:16:38 AM »

CMcG you are Belfast forums treasure, astounding connecting detective work

PGTIP86
have a go at griffiths valuation website at http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/  the entries are all printed in 1863 find
GOURLEY   JAMES   DOWN   COMBER          map ref 18 in Magherascouse townland Comber civil parishhas house valued £2.10shillings pa office and land 28 acres.  explore and learn how to look up their map ref.  after seeing the blgs, switch entirely to your modern google map icon you can see the current buildings by going to modern google maps type in ‘21A  Magherascouse road ‘. you will see the road has a lane going westwards in a straight line stay on it and arrive at the homestead  switch to satellite view, ignore the series of sheds there are two older darker buildings which in shape and size match the buildings on the griffiths valuation map so that’s a one of your ancestors James Gourley’s homestead over 160 years ago Do the same for John and and Elizabeth   The railway line to Comber is to the west closeby.
GOURLEY   JOHN   DOWN   COMBER   map ref 15 in Magherascouse townland Comber civil parish has house valued £1.15shillings pa office and land 19 acres
GOURLEY   Elizabeth   DOWN   COMBER          map ref 45 in Magherascouse townland Comber civil parish has house valued £1 pa office and land 5 acre has 6 fields and borders Magherascouse lough but with a boggy surrounding edge

if you want to learn more about Magherascouse go to http://www.comberhistory.com/index.htm#alpha1 look down the rh column there is mention of a free download 30 mb PDF file a directory of Comber. Download it and find Magherascouse

then backwards in time about 30 years in particular 1835
1823-1837 Tithes Applotment Books
http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/down/tithe-applotment-books/comber-parish.php#.VPAjYEt5kYU
The relevant original books are in the Public Record Office of Northern Ireland (PRONI) Belfast the material is just one line  ie name and qty of land for taxation purposes for the C of I.
Goorley, Thomas Townland: Ballyaltikilligan Year: 1835
Goorley, Thomas Townland: Ballygowan Year: 1835
Goorley, William Townland: Crossnacrievy Year: 1835
Goorley, John Townland: Magherascouse Year: 1835
Goorley, Robert Townland: Magherascouse Year: 1835

Ros Davies Co Down website becomes important please use
then earlier PRONI, Church records etc
run out of time
I stop on the Magherascouse line although the history of the name remains, Scots? even Normandy? see Oxford names companion

McCrystal any idea of dates for Jane Gourley

PRS

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #13 on: August 03, 2019, 10:59:55 AM »
JimG's response #4 throws up an addresses on my Gourley Research tree.

Andrew Gourley Born 23 May 1855, Died 4 March 1925 at 32 Glendower Street Belfast, Carpenter. (son Thomas of 25 Lecumpher Street Belfast present at death). Son of Thomas Gourley & Matilda Black.
Husband of Jane McLarnon,  married 17 Feb 1885 Clifton Street Presbyterian Church Belfast. His father Thomas was a farmer.(marriage cert shows his address as 119 Nth Queen Street Belfast , Home of a Mary Conlon, next door at 121 is a Thomas Gourley, Carpenter ? ).   Jane resided 19 Hanover Street Belfast her father David McLarnon, was a timber merchant.

Children; Matilda 24/11/1885 - 05/01/1890, Mary Jane 30/03/1887 -1909, Sarah 28/02/19/890, John 24/12/1893 , Thomas 24/06/1894 @ 8 Derg Street Belfast, and James  27/10/1896 also at 8 Derg Street Belfast.

!890 Belfast Street Directory ; 49 Hopeton Street Belfast - Andrew Gowley, Carpenter.   (surname misspelling ?)  Relation of George at # 79 ?

CMcG

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Re: Anyone searching Gourley (Belfast)
« Reply #14 on: August 03, 2019, 12:03:47 PM »

... Andrew Gourley Born 23 May 1855, Died 4 March 1925 at 32 Glendower Street Belfast, Carpenter. (son Thomas of 25 Lecumpher Street Belfast present at death


That's the same Thomas I mentioned on your other topic, the one who married Jean Boyd in 1921 and after 25 Lecumpher Street moved to 139 Castlereagh Road:

http://www.belfastforum.co.uk/index.php/topic,77349.0.html