Author Topic: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan  (Read 296 times)

efcmci

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Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« on: October 09, 2019, 11:24:18 AM »
Hello all!
Looking information regarding Joseph Mcilwaine who lived in 27 Bridgend Belfast who married Lilian Mcgowan of 55 Beechfield Street, Belfast. I have attached their marriage certificate.   Many thanks in advance!!

lillian + joseph marr

CMcG

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #1 on: October 09, 2019, 12:09:29 PM »
On the face of it, this looks like a candidate for Joseph in 1911:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Armagh/Lurgan_Urban/Union_Street/296859/

And 1901:
http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1901/Armagh/Lurgan_Urban/Moore_s_Lane/1025935/

The birth of the Joseph in the above census returns (1896) - note the Jackson witness in the 1917 marriage:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1896/02165/1820557.pdf

Notwithstanding the groom's different occupation and the variation in his surname, the following looks like the marriage for Joseph's parents (1889):
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1889/10748/5919417.pdf

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CMcG

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #2 on: October 09, 2019, 12:37:56 PM »
I can see a daughter Mary Elizabeth born to a Joseph McIlwaine and Lilian Magowan on 30 April 1920, Joseph was recorded as a hairdresser and the address was given as 11 Mayne Street.

The 1918 Belfast street directory entry for Mayne Street on the Lennon Wylie website lists the following:
11. McIlwaine, Jos., hair dresser

http://www.lennonwylie.co.uk/mcomplete1918.htm

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CMcG

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #3 on: October 09, 2019, 12:44:42 PM »
If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

efcmci

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #4 on: October 09, 2019, 02:51:32 PM »


quote author=CMcG link=topic=78048.msg2166866#msg2166866 date=1570621482]
There are several possible candidates for Lilian Magowan, for the moment I'm leaning towards the daughter born in 1897 to James Magowan and Eliza Lynas:

Parent's marriage (1894):

So just to note until it can be ruled in or out.

Many thanks for this information really appreciate your help! :)

efcmci

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #5 on: October 09, 2019, 02:57:30 PM »
I can see a daughter Mary Elizabeth born to a Joseph McIlwaine and Lilian Magowan on 30 April 1920, Joseph was recorded as a hairdresser and the address was given as 11 Mayne Street.

The 1918 Belfast street directory entry for Mayne Street on the Lennon Wylie website lists the following:
11. McIlwaine, Jos., hair dresser

Do you have details of daughter Mary Elizabeth born to a Joseph McIlwaine and Lilian Magowan on 30 April 1920,

We know they had the following children
Lilian, William, Norman
We heard Lilian died as a young child from an accident while swinging around a lamp post.


CMcG

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #6 on: October 09, 2019, 04:33:59 PM »

(1)  Do you have details of daughter Mary Elizabeth born to a Joseph McIlwaine and Lilian Magowan on 30 April 1920 ...

(2) We heard Lilian died as a young child from an accident while swinging around a lamp post ...


(1) Other than what I've already posted, namely that Joseph was recorded as a hairdresser and the address was given as 11 Mayne Street.

(2) As far as I can determine, the likeliest candidate for the death of a daughter Lilian was one who died at the age of 8 from meningitis in 1929, she was described as the 'Child of Hairdresser', the given address was 57 Wellington Street Lurgan, and the informant of her death was her aunt Elizabeth McIlwaine who married James Hull in 1909:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1909/10034/5649738.pdf

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1911/Armagh/Lurgan_Urban/Ann_Street/335535/
 
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efcmci

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #7 on: October 09, 2019, 05:02:42 PM »

Fabulous information, Can i view online the following information

1  regarding Lilian who died at the age of 8 from meningitis in 1929,
2  daughter Mary Elizabeth born to a Joseph McIlwaine and Lilian Magowan on 30 April 1920
I was also told that Lilian left her husband and children and emigrated to either America or Canada,The children were taken to Lurgan to be reared with their aunts. That is why Lilian was living with Lizzy.

CMcG

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #8 on: October 09, 2019, 11:08:29 PM »
No. 1 is available on a 'pay to view' basis via the following Northern Ireland Government website:
https://geni.nidirect.gov.uk/

No. 2 (transcript only) is available on the following subscription based website:
https://www.rootsireland.ie/

The UK Outward passenger lists show a Lilian McIlwaine embarking at Belfast for Quebec on 20 August 1927, her age is a bit out (25), she is recorded as a domestic, last address given as 16 London Road Belfast.  The associated ship's manifest eluded me, the only one I could find had her name crossed out, which may mean that she got another earlier sailing, anyhow, she was recorded on that manifest as single and her nearest kin was given as her step-sister, Mrs. Chambers of 16 London Road Belfast.  Which reads across to this:



And to these folk in the PRONI Will Calendars index:

Chambers William James of 16 London Road Belfast time-keeper died 9 June 1943 Administration Belfast 24 August to Margaret Edith Chambers the widow. Effects 639 16s. 11d.

Chambers Margaret Edith of 16 London Road Belfast widow died 21 December 1944 at the Belfast City Hospital Administration Belfast 28 February to Alfred Magowan gentleman. Effects 877 1s. 1d.

https://apps.proni.gov.uk/WillsCalendar_IE/WillsSearch.aspx

I guess that the following may be the marriage:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1912/09928/5609452.pdf

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

CMcG

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #9 on: October 09, 2019, 11:39:53 PM »
The following 1887 birth registration confirms that Edith in the previously posted 1911 census return for house 35 in Corcreeny was more fully 'Margaret Edith', the daughter of James Magowan and his first wife Jane McNabb, and step-sister to Lilian (Magowan) McIlwaine:
https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1887/02564/1948369.pdf

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

CMcG

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #10 on: October 10, 2019, 10:21:33 AM »

... The UK Outward passenger lists show a Lilian McIlwaine embarking at Belfast for Quebec on 20 August 1927, her age is a bit out (25), she is recorded as a domestic, last address given as 16 London Road Belfast.  The associated ship's manifest eluded me, the only one I could find had her name crossed out, which may mean that she got another earlier sailing, anyhow, she was recorded on that manifest as single and her nearest kin was given as her step-sister, Mrs. Chambers of 16 London Road Belfast ...


Just to clarify the above, for I now know more.  The entry crossed out for Lilian McIlwaine on the Regina's manifest (saying that she did not embark) was for the sailing from Belfast on 28 May 1927, arriving at Quebec on 4 June. However, I have now found her on the Regina's manifest for the sailing leaving Belfast on 20 August and arriving at Quebec on 27 August, the quality is very poor  (which is why I couldn't spot her), but the blurred details appear to be the same as those crossed out on the previous manifest (note: including a marital status of single).

Be aware that a marriage took place in Toronto a couple of months later on 30 October 1927 between a Lilian McIlwaine and a Darnley Luther Holder, Lilian was described as a 24 year old presbyterian spinster, a domestic, place of birth Ireland, parents James McIlwaine and Margret Lynass, it might be just a co-incidence, but there again...

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efcmci

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #11 on: October 10, 2019, 10:38:14 AM »
The UK Outward passenger lists show a Lilian McIlwaine embarking at Belfast for Quebec on 20 August 1927, her age is a bit out (25), she is recorded as a domestic, last address given as 16 London Road Belfast.  The associated ship's manifest eluded me, the only one I could find had her name crossed out, which may mean that she got another earlier sailing, anyhow, she was recorded on that manifest as single and her nearest kin was given as her step-sister, Mrs. Chambers of 16 London Road Belfast. 

With your wonderful help i have found this, It says she travelled with the salvation army party. I am wondering if this man is her lover or was it just a cover to leave. I can't find any trace of her after leaving N Ireland, 

No photo description available.

CMcG

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Re: Joseph Mcilwaine and Lilian Mcgowan
« Reply #12 on: October 10, 2019, 10:54:13 AM »
This is an extract of the clearer manifest (the one of 28 May when Lilian didn't embark), it even mentions Lurgan as a birthplace, I think the fact that she presented herself as single is worth noting:




It would be worth pursuing the Toronto marriage I mentioned, if only to eliminate it. I have little experience of Canadian research and my instinct would be to advise posting in the Canada section of the 'RootsChat' website.

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.