Author Topic: My hubby's GGfather was George Hillis.Married on 20/1/1859 St.Anne's. Shankhill.  (Read 1119 times)

jah1

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He died 22/7/1889 in Kinegar. Hollywood. Co. Down.
I can't find his birth. Any suggestions.
From his marriage cert his Father was Robert Hillis.
He married Isabella Higginson whose Father was Thomas.
I cannot find out Georges's Mother's name to establish which "Robert" of the many listed around that time was his father or if I could find his birth to establish his age it might help.
I would be grateful of any help I can get, Thank you.
He had 2 children as I know of. Samuel Hillis b.24/5/1871 (Hubby's Gfather) and Joseph Kennedy Hillis b.1/6/1874.
It seems strange that there were over 12 years between their marriage and the birth of their first child and yet I can't find any other children.

sam barry

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There is an Article in the Belfast News Letter, dated Saturday 17th August 1889, in which it states that Isabella the widow of George,
summoned the Pearl Life Assurance Company for the recovery of the sum of 11.11s.11d, which was due to her on the death of her husband, I think reading it the Assurance Company were querying it, because of arrears in payment. At a later date they did pay her.
Perhaps someone with a bit more knowledge of copying these articles could copy it onto the forum for you.
The only other bit of information it has, is that it mentions a son ROBERT H. HILLIS.
I have added a copy of their Marriage, just in case it helps others to assist you:

Type   Civil Marriages
Date of Marriage   20/01/1859
Husband's Name   GEORGE HILLIS
Husband's Address   BALINDERRY CO ANTRIM
Husband's Occupation   FARMER
Husband's Denomination   Church of Ireland
Husband's Marital Status   Bachelor (Previously unmarried)
Husband's Father's Name   ROBERT HILLIS
Husband's Father's Occupation   FARMER
Husband's Witness   ROBERT HIGGINSON
Wife's Name   ISABELLA HIGGINSON
Wife's Address   BELFAST
Wife's Denomination   Church of Ireland
Wife's Marital Status   Spinster (Previously unmarried)
Wife's Father's Name   THOMAS HIGGINSON
Wife's Father's Occupation   FARMER
Wife's Witness   MARY ANNE HIGGINSON
Comment   BY LICENCE REV M MCKAY.
Address 1   ST ANNE'S Church of Ireland
Address 2   BELFAST


CMcG

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... He died 22/7/1889 in Kinegar. Hollywood. Co. Down.
I can't find his birth. Any suggestions ...


Hi, I'm afraid you won't ever find a birth, c. 1839 was way before the introduction of any system of birth registration here.  Looking for possible baptisms, I couldn't see anything online. But there again, baptismal records for that era offer no guarantee of providing what you want, sometimes the mother's name wasn't mentioned at all.

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

CMcG

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Until you can otherwise explain the following birth (eg. by finding a William Hillis - Isabella Higginson marriage), I wouldn't rule out the William Stevenson Hillis born in 1868 out as a son:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/birth_returns/births_1868/03458/2269719.pdf

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

JimG

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I became bemused by two farmers children apparently from Ballinderry marrying in St Annes Belfast about 15 miles away with Lisburn only 5 miles away and even closer churches and wondered mixed marriage at the word licence[ however not special license]. Isabella was living in Belfast at the time and the marriage certificate said C of I for both. The Higginsons of the area some 50 years later were all Moravians. So I dropped that possible red herring and looked at Tithes 1823-1837 for Ballinderry civil parish

http://www.irishgenealogyhub.com/antrim/tithe-applotments/ballinderry-parish.php
Higgihson, James Townland: Ballinderry Year: 1833
Higgins, Elizabeth Townland: Tawnibally-Donnell Year: 1833
Higgins, James Townland: Tawnibally-Donnell Year: 1833
Higginson, Burliegh Townland: Druminduff Year: 1833
Higginson, George Townland: Druminduff Year: 1833
Higginson, George Townland: Logherelish Year: 1833
Higginson, George Townland: Moneycromog Year: 1833
Higginson, Howe Townland: Templecormack Year: 1833
Higginson, James Townland: Ballinderry Year: 1833
HIGGINSON, THOS. TOWNLAND: BALLYSCOLLY YEAR: 1833
Higginson, Widow Townland: Druminduff Year: 1833
Higginson, Wm. Townland: Ballykelly Year: 1833
Higginson, Wm. Townland: Ballymaclose Year: 1833
HILLES, ROBT.   TOWNLAND: AGHACARNON YEAR: 1833
HILLES, ROBT.   TOWNLAND: DERRYKILLULTAGH YEAR: 1833

Griffiths valuation ~1862  gives L as location meaning townland ?
Higginson, Charlotte   L: Ballinderry
Higginson, Doloway   L: Ballinderry
Higginson, Edward   L: Legatirriff
Higginson, Francis   L: Drumanduff
Higginson, George   L: Ballylacky
Higginson, George   L: Drumanduff
Higginson, George   L: Loughrelisk
Higginson, John     L: Ballykelly
Higginson, John           L: Derrykillultagh
Higginson, Pitt           L: Ballyscolly
Higginson, Robert   L: Drumanduff
Higginson, Samuel   L: Ballyscolly
HIGGINSON, THOMAS   L: BALLYMACLOSE
HIGGINSON, THOMAS   L: DRUMANDUFF
Higginson, Wesley   L: Ballyscolly
Higginson, William   L: Ballinderry
Hillis, Bernard            L: Aghacarnan
Hillis, Bernard            L: Drumanduff
HILLIS, ROBERT       L: DERRYKILLULTAGH
HILLIS, ROBERT       L: DRUMANDUFF

however neither source  give family connections so back to surviving church records
PRONI gives
C.I. Ballinderry (Connor diocese) Baptisms, 1806-71; marriages, 1805-45; burials, 182371; vestry minutes, 1790-1870 and 1929; extracts from baptisms relating to the Higgins family, 1806-37.
just this one Church of Ireland with further nicro film references

jah1

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Thank you for all the information.
Re William Hillis and Isabella Higginson .
Could it be possible that there were 2 families of Higginsons each with a daughter named Isabella.
The George and William could be brothers.
It could maybe help find the right "Robert" if there was one with a George and a William as sons.Long shot but it may be worth a try. What does anyone think?
My hubby's Grandfather's dob matches exactly with that of the Samuel Hillis born to George and Isabella.None of the family can remember him having any siblings. I did find 1 brother born 1/6/1874. Both boys were baptised at 750,Knockandona .Antrim.(Samuel on 24/5/1871 the same day as he was born) Not knowing the area I don't know if this was an address or what it was, The second son died in his teens.Not sure of the date ,will have to try and find it.

CMcG

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... Re William Hillis and Isabella Higginson .
Could it be possible that there were 2 families of Higginsons each with a daughter named Isabella.
The George and William could be brothers.


IMHO that is pushing co-incidence a bit, if you look at the civil birth registration for William Stevenson Hillis in 1868, apart from that one difference in the father's forename (which I'm leaning towards being a simple mistake), everything else is identical to the births of Samuel Hillis in 1871 and Joseph Kennedy Hillis in 1874 - most critically, the address is the same for all 3 births, namely the townland of Magheraliskmisk in the parish of Magheragall:

https://www.townlands.ie/antrim/massereene-upper/magheragall/magheraliskmisk/

To put it in perspective, for the co-incidence to work, that would mean that both a couple called William Hillis and Isabella Higginson and a couple called George Hillis and Isabella Higginson were living in that same townland

BTW, Griffiths Valuation shows one 'Hillis' in the townland (print date 1862), namely George Hillis farming just over 26 acres, there is also a George Higginson:

http://www.askaboutireland.ie/griffith-valuation/index.xml?action=placeSearch

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

JimG

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1862 Griffiths Valuation Magheraliskmisk in Magheragall:
George Hillis has 26 acres and a house valued at 3 pa
map ref 8 in Magheraliskmisk
Directions  it is nr Fabrite engineering on the north side of Hallstown Road about 250 yards east of the junction with Winter Lane. looks like major developments have since taken place
he remains the occupier in  PRONI Valuation Revision Books  references
VAL/12/B/8/13B (1869 - 1881) has no mention of any change date in margin his landlord changed from Marquis of Hertford ? to Sir R Wallace. 
VAL/12/B/8/13C (1881 - 1894) his name is crossed out dated 1882 in margin, 3 other people succeded to the property a Dunlop, Byrans and a McKee


CMcG

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The following looks like a possibility for Robert Hillis, Druminaduff (Drumanduff) would be consistent with the Robert Hillis in Griffith's Valuation who is farming in that townland and the neighbouring townland of Derrykillultagh:

The Will of Robert Hillis late of Druminaduff County Antrim Farmer deceased who died 1 October 1871 at same place was proved at Belfast by the oath of William John Oakman of Ashvale Templecormick in said County the Executor.

https://apps.proni.gov.uk/WillsCalendar_IE/WillsSearch.aspx

If you read the image of the will, you will see mention of a wife Ann and various children including George.

A slight problem this raises is that while there are a number of baptisms in Ballinderry Church of Ireland parish from 1821 to 1840 for a couple called Robert and Ann Hillis, which are consistent with the children's forenames mentioned in the will, the baptism for George was on 30 July 1826, some 13 years before the birth year indicated for the George Hillis who died in 1889 (ie. indicated by his reported age).  However, I still wouldn't rule it out, reported age at death is notoriously unreliable.

The will mentions a daughter Eliza Jane McClelland, that would seem to read across to the following 1869 Ballinderry Parish marriage of an Eliza Hillis of Templecormac (which is a neighbouring townland of Drumanduff, father given as Robt. Hillis a farmer, critically, one of the witness names is a match for 1859 marriage of George Hillis and Isabella Higginson, ie. Mary Ann Higginson:

https://civilrecords.irishgenealogy.ie/churchrecords/images/marriage_returns/marriages_1869/11408/8189366.pdf

One of the Ballinderry Parish baptisms I mentioned for Robert and Ann Hillis was indeed for an Eliza Jane Hillis in 1821.

The will also mentions a daughter Margaret Stevenson, which reads across to the Ballinderry Parish marriage of John Stevenson to a 26 year old Margaret Hillis of Templecormac, it took place on 13 February 1852, Margaret's father was given as Robert Hillis, a farmer, and a George Hillis was one of the witnesses.  Note, this might explain the middle name Stevenson given to William Stevenson Hillis in 1868 that I mentioned at reply #3.

One of the Ballinderry Parish baptisms I mentioned for Robert and Ann Hillis was indeed for a Margaret Hillis in 1824.

The will also mentions a daughter Ann Ball - I haven't found a marriage, but again, one of the Ballinderry Parish baptisms I mentioned for Robert and Ann Hillis was indeed for an Ann Hillis in 1831. The will mentions sons Jonathan and Samuel, again there are baptisms in 1828 and 1835 respectively.

If you can get over the birth year disparity for George (I've seen worse), I'm reasonably comfortable that this may be him.

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

CMcG

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Look's like the name of the farm was Quail's Wood.

27 March 1869:


2 October 1871:


31 January 1874:


27 March 1874:


16 March 1876:


22 September 1877:


If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

CMcG

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...The will also mentions a daughter Margaret Stevenson, which reads across to the Ballinderry Parish marriage of John Stevenson to a 26 year old Margaret Hillis of Templecormac, it took place on 13 February 1852, Margaret's father was given as Robert Hillis, a farmer, and a George Hillis was one of the witnesses.  Note, this might explain the middle name Stevenson given to William Stevenson Hillis in 1868 that I mentioned at reply #3 ...


On the foot of the will for Robert Hillis I mentioned at reply #8 above, here's another potential dot joining up...

It's the following Will Calendars index entry on the PRONI website for the John Stevenson who married Margaret Hillis in 1852, one of the executors is cited as George Hillis and critically, his address is given as Magheragall, which fits nicely with the contemporary address for George Hillis and Isabella Higginson at the time of their son Joseph Kennedy Hillis' birth in 1874: 

The Will of John Stevenson late of Old Lodge-road Belfast County Antrim Grocer deceased who died 2 February 1875 at same place was proved at Belfast by the oath of George Hillis of Magheragall (Lisburn) County Antrim Farmer one of the Executors.

You can find the entry and read the will here:

https://apps.proni.gov.uk/WillsCalendar_IE/WillsSearch.aspx

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

CMcG

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Just noticed that this Hillis family appears in the few surviving fragments of the 1851 census:

http://www.census.nationalarchives.ie/pages/1851/Antrim/Upper_Massereene/Ballinderry/Drumanduff/2/

The following transcript suggests an 1824 marriage for Robert and Ann:



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CMcG

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Another will in the Will Calendars, this time for Robert and Ann Hillis' son Samuel mentioned at reply # 9 above, the one who married Susanna Peel:

The Will of Samuel Hillis late of Drumnaduff County Antrim Farmer deceased who died 15 March 1876 at same place was proved at Belfast by the oath of George Hillis of Magheragall in said County Farmer the Executor.

The will mentions the disposal of Quail's Wood, also brother George Hillis and sisters Elizabeth Jane McClelland and Margaret Stephenson, you can read it at the link to the PRONI website I've previously posted.

If there are any images posted above that are important to you, take your own copy - I cannot guarantee they will appear indefinitely.

CMcG

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Another will in the Will Calendars, this time for Robert and Ann Hillis' son Samuel mentioned at reply # 9 above, the one who married Susanna Peel:

The Will of Samuel Hillis late of Drumnaduff County Antrim Farmer deceased who died 15 March 1876 at same place was proved at Belfast by the oath of George Hillis of Magheragall in said County Farmer the Executor.

The will mentions the disposal of Quail's Wood, also brother George Hillis and sisters Elizabeth Jane McClelland and Margaret Stephenson, you can read it at the link to the PRONI website I've previously posted.


A few years later after the above will was executed (with George Hillis also being one of the beneficiaries), this appeared in the Northern Whig (21 December 1880), I'm reckoning that this might have been him finally selling off his own farm and what he inherited from brother Samuel, prior to a retirement move (to Holywood?):



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jah1

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Thank you so much for all this info. I have read through it and am trying to put it together as a family tree but am struggling a bit. Do you know in the Census, what do the initials RW and against Isabella S/L mean? As most of the info adds up apart from some of the dates , where in your opinion does the "William and Isabella  and their son " fit in.
I have been stuck for years trying to get around Robert but not having the knowlege and reference sites you seem to have ,I was not able to progress. This would seem to be the most logical answer. Is there any mention anywhere re Joseph Kennegy Hillis marrying. I think I found a reference of him somewhere which suggested he died young, Unfortunately at the time I hadn't realised he was my Hubby's Grandfather's (Samuel) brother and haven't managed to find it since.